Transcript of the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable: August 30 2018
Topic: “Through Despair and Hope: The Circle of Second Life” – a presentation/discussion led by Mark Childs (Gann McGann in SL)
Note that Gann’s main talk was in voice: he copied key information into text chat, but some chat comments relate to his untranscribed speech.
Lightly edited for typos by Sheila Yoshikawa; photo by Sheila Yoshikawa
[2018/09/06 12:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: Hi everyone, and welcome to the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable. We meet on Thursdays at 12 noon SLT for an hour. 8pm In UK, 3pm EST.
[2018/09/06 12:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: VWER is a forum to educate and inform the community about issues that are important and relevant to education in virtual worlds. This is a public meeting, so we will be keeping and publishing a transcript.
[2018/09/06 12:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: The transcripts can be found at https://vwer.info/ The VWER continues to develop a community of educators from around the world
[2018/09/06 12:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: Please join the VWER group here in SL. If you are on Facebook, or Google+ please join our group there. Our group on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/groups/159154226946/, and our Google+ community at https://plus.google.com/u/0/communities/101630374387475211030
[2018/09/06 12:04] Sheila Yoshikawa: I am chairing the session today.
[2018/09/06 12:04] Sheila Yoshikawa: After our normal introductions the topic for this week’s meeting will be: “Through Despair and Hope: The Circle of Second Life” with Gann McGann (in voice) followed by a text chat discussion
[2018/09/06 12:05] Sheila Yoshikawa: Let’s start as we normally do and introduce ourselves
[2018/09/06 12:05] ThinkererSelby Evans (thinkerer.melville): Selby Evans, Blogger, An interactive, social 3D writer’s workshop in a browser. And how to mix workshop with interactive fiction. https://virtualoutworlding.blogspot.com/2018/09/2018-write-edu-interactive-social-3d.html
[2018/09/06 12:05] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Dan Holt, English professor, Lansing CC, Lansing, MI.
[2018/09/06 12:05] Gann McGann: I’m Mark Childs, I’m a learning developer at the open university UK
[2018/09/06 12:05] Beth Ghostraven: Hi Dan! Welcome back!
[2018/09/06 12:05] Beth Ghostraven: Hi Liss!
[2018/09/06 12:05] Sheila Yoshikawa: I’m Sheila and I teach and research in the Information School at the University of sheffield and blog at http://information-literacy.blogspot.com and I am co-leader of VWER
[2018/09/06 12:05] Beth Ghostraven: I’m Beth Ghostraven, middle school teacher-librarian in RL and owner of the Book and Tankard Pub in Victoria City, Caledon in SL; owner of Ghostraven Professional Attire, classic clothing for educators in SL (http://bethghostraven.com); Communications Chair for the VWBPE Conference; Communications Chair and Focus Sessions Producer for the ISTE Virtual Environments Network; and unofficial liaison between education groups in SL. For information on events for the educational groups that I work with, see the ISTE VEN Massive Open Online Calendar at http://venetwork.weebly.com/calendar.html; Twitter: @booklady9 I’ll be taking photos to publish with the transcript and recording this session on video; if you have any objection, please IM me.
[2018/09/06 12:05] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Hey, Beth!
[2018/09/06 12:06] Sheila Yoshikawa: Hi Liss
[2018/09/06 12:06] Ẏαẕẕ Ącкмann (yazz.skytower): I’m Yasmine Vargas, graduate student at the University of Puerto Rico in communication theory. I’m currently studying representations of racial identities in roleplay in Second Life.
[2018/09/06 12:06] Camie Rembrandt: Independent E-Learning Professional, Adult and Continuing Education Teacher with a Postgraduate Diploma in Education (E-Learning Pedagogy). Writer and Digital Storyteller. Owner of Learning Lab on Craft World grid.
[2018/09/06 12:06] Su Nacht: Susanna Nocchi – Dublin Institute of Technology – Lecturer in Italian – Researcher in Applied Linguistics, CALL (computer assisted language learning), mainly on Digital Literacies and in the use of Virtual Worlds for language learning. Chair of the EuroCALL Virtual World SIG
[2018/09/06 12:07] Wisdomseeker (lissena): is Lynne Berrett, NYC Metro area, owner of Inspiration Island, CEO of Whole Brain Health Training Program. FB: Virtual Inspiration Island; website: http://VirtualInspirationIsland.org. Board Member NonprofitCommons
[2018/09/06 12:07] Sheila Yoshikawa: So, Gann, would you like to start?
[2018/09/06 12:07] Sheila Yoshikawa: whenever you are ready
[2018/09/06 12:07] Sheila Yoshikawa: he is speaking now
[2018/09/06 12:08] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): I can hear you.
[2018/09/06 12:08] ThinkererSelby Evans (thinkerer.melville): hearing
[2018/09/06 12:08] Gann McGann: 2016 did a presentation at the SOLSTICE conference
Meeting with John Kirriemuir (In RL!) – author Virtual World Watch 2007 – 2012 during which period every UK HEI had some involvement
Reminisced about people that we’d known from Second Life
Some still working in field, many left
Vicar, gardener, silversmith, shopworker, international developer
[2018/09/06 12:08] Camie Rembrandt: voice is great
[2018/09/06 12:08] Su Nacht: I hear you perfectly
[2018/09/06 12:08] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): Christian Angel Candidate for a PhD in Educational Technology. Consultant: Educational Technology – Virtual Worlds Education – Virtual Reality – VW – Metaverse – TIC -SEO – Social Media Marketing & Marketing 2.0 – Design
[2018/09/06 12:08] Sheila Yoshikawa: and as you see he is also typing key points in text chat
[2018/09/06 12:08] Gann McGann: Question about the creative deployers?
Impact on them, their careers, their reflections?
Opportunistic sample of 20 educators – self-selected
[2018/09/06 12:09] Sheila Yoshikawa: The virtualworldwatch reports are at http://www.silversprite.com/?page_id=353
[2018/09/06 12:09] Sheila Yoshikawa: I and Gann both were amongst the contributors
[2018/09/06 12:09] Gann McGann: “Opportunistic sample” = I asked my mates
Half responded by deadline – producing around 8000 words in total
So – not representative, but intended to identify some experiences
Usual grounded approach to qualitative data
If anything – impression is that it’s biased towards positive experiences, as some equivocated due to “having moved on
Who were the respondents?
1 USA, 1 Canada, 1 Australia, remainder UK
8 still working in education
Only 4 still working in virtual worlds (though 2 others maintain their avatar because they can’t let them go) – Sue G, Beth, Liz and Sheila
2 of those 4 have also moved into virtual worlds other than SL
[2018/09/06 12:09] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): voice is great
[2018/09/06 12:09] Sheila Yoshikawa: I meant to virtualworldwatch
[2018/09/06 12:09] MystiTool HUD 1.0.23: Entering chat range: Marly Milena (19m)
[2018/09/06 12:10] Marly (marly.milena): Am I invisible? Hi, all!
[2018/09/06 12:10] Beth Ghostraven: Hi Marly!
[2018/09/06 12:10] Su Nacht: Hi marly
[2018/09/06 12:11] Gann McGann: Looked at literature that explores the impact of innovation in education on innovators; their professional development, career progress, etc.
[2018/09/06 12:11] Sheila Yoshikawa: you are visible Marly
[2018/09/06 12:11] Gann McGann: Nothing: Innovation in education solely explored in terms of impact on learners and learning
[2018/09/06 12:12] Gann McGann: Mumtaz (2000) lists 60 sources, looking at causes of teachers’ resistance to institutional changes. Nothing in literature on causes of institutions’ resistance to teachers’ changes.
[2018/09/06 12:12] MystiTool HUD 1.0.23: Entering chat range: AngryBeth Shortbread (9m)
[2018/09/06 12:12] Sheila Yoshikawa: yes we were agreeing that it is the institution that resists, rather than the educator
[2018/09/06 12:13] Second Life: You decline ‘[S] Amara Glitter Top & Bandage Skirt Pink Ad’ ( http://slurl.com/secondlife/Lions%20Hill/110/47/21 ) from [satus Inc].
[2018/09/06 12:13] Second Life: You decline ‘[S] Amara Glitter Top & Bandage Skirt Demo [boxed]’ ( http://slurl.com/secondlife/Lions%20Hill/110/47/21 ) from [satus Inc].
[2018/09/06 12:13] Gann McGann: What did you see as the potential of virtual worlds?
“IBM used this space for a variety of business purposes, including leadership development, but the main rationale was that they could save money and time by avoiding transporting people from all parts of the globe. .. it was only later that I began to see some of the potential of more immersive learning experiences. ” – Jim
“For Distance student the benefits seem so obvious – a break away from the faceless books and text, an extension of the discussion board that could really bring learning to life. Not to mention the support aspects of being able to ‘talk’ to someone whom you felt was ‘there’ much more so than a telephone call.” – Susie
“A way to engage with off-campus students” – Sue G
[2018/09/06 12:13] Marly (marly.milena): The institution is made up of educators and administrators, yes? So wouldn’t there be an array of responses?
[2018/09/06 12:15] Sheila Yoshikawa: @Marly, it often means “the institution” meaning statements and decrees that “come down” from senior managers etc. as Gann is describing, and which the eduicators are exhorted to follow
[2018/09/06 12:15] Marly (marly.milena): Sigh…
[2018/09/06 12:15] Su Nacht: I so agree!!!
[2018/09/06 12:16] Sheila Yoshikawa: yay Futurelearn lol
[2018/09/06 12:16] Sheila Yoshikawa: and for a while the idea that all students were using tablets, so make it all about tablets
[2018/09/06 12:16] Gann McGann: Potential for subject discipline
“First of all the possibilities for collaborative creation and telepresence. Then increasingly the creation of an immersive experience.” – Chris
“a brave new world full of potential” – Joff
“intriguing from a social perspective. Here was a space where people world-wide could log in and be in the same environment but be from vastly different geographical locations. The intercultural relational possibilities were huge.”- Paul J
“It was new, it needed research and exploration to discover what it was going to be good at … Many innovations/inventions etc start out this way. We have this ‘thing’, we dont know yet what we can do, but let’s see…” Susie
[2018/09/06 12:16] Beth Ghostraven: so, desktop recording for lecturing, the least effective way of teaching…
[2018/09/06 12:17] Sheila Yoshikawa: though, to be fair, some students do like watching talks
[2018/09/06 12:18] Su Nacht: me
[2018/09/06 12:18] Sheila Yoshikawa: yes I’ve had that
[2018/09/06 12:18] Beth Ghostraven: The SAMR Model may be relevant here: https://sites.google.com/a/msad60.org/technology-is-learning/samr-model
[2018/09/06 12:18] Sheila Yoshikawa: thanks Beth
[2018/09/06 12:18] Beth Ghostraven: yw :o)
[2018/09/06 12:19] Gann McGann: Looked like fun
“I saw higher student engagement as the promise of virtual worlds.”- Beth
““Having fun whilst teaching”? To be honest, I just registered for SL before going to the JISC seminar in May 2007, was hooked instantly, and then thought “How can I get some money so I can do lots of this SL stuff”.” – Sheila
[2018/09/06 12:19] Sheila Yoshikawa: Hi Quintus
[2018/09/06 12:19] Gann McGann:
“To be honest, I didn’t see much promise at all. They felt strange and somewhat subversive to me … My conversion came through experiencing Peter Yellowlees‘s schizophrenia simulation, which just blew me away.” – Liz
[2018/09/06 12:20] QVINTVS PETILIVS SECVNDVS (severusalexander): hello all
[2018/09/06 12:20] Su Nacht: In a way … I found it so much fun, I HAD to show my students 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:20] Camie Rembrandt: yes
[2018/09/06 12:20] Marly (marly.milena): It was my opportunity to create based on my arts and psychology skills
[2018/09/06 12:21] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Distance ed–having a place for students to meet, have class, work as a writing community.
[2018/09/06 12:21] Gann McGann: What did you achieve with them?
Improved learner experience
“We found a way of engaging a user with archival material in a way which turned out to be very powerful.” – Chris
“Massive amounts, I think. I’ve been working in these environments now for the best part of 10 years and have mentored, supported and worked with colleagues and students on simulations in law, business ethics, psychology, education, forensic science, environmental health, computer science and financial auditing, which have helped to engage students in some areas of learning that they were finding problematic due to complexity, lack of physical world practical time” – Liz
“Key environment for a core first year UG module … Key environment in an optional Masters module for 7 years” – Sheila
“Because so many things are possible in virtual worlds , I found teaching students in the classroom that they were very excited about the possibilities (generally things took longer or were harder for them to achieve than they first thought ) and it allowed them to safely think right outside the box” – Joff
[2018/09/06 12:22] Marly (marly.milena): and to introduce NEW WAYS of learning!
[2018/09/06 12:24] Sheila Yoshikawa: oh Gann I think the end of that last bit of text was cut off?
[2018/09/06 12:24] Gann McGann: Research into subject discipline
“I ended up with was a 5+ year run of exploring identity in virtual worlds, human behaviour (from sex to education to helping to creativity). I was able to develop a working model of the spaces of real life, computer mediated experience, and virtual life.” – Paul J
“Learning new techniques with regard to live performance, set design, directing and teaching. Teaching both entirely in-world and also in the classroom. A number of performances , some entirely in-world with SLCC and ART , some blended/mixed reality Summer Dancing, SD2, Staging Second Life, and a mixed reality installation in collaboration with Stelarc and Ian Upton.” – Joff
Research into subject discipline
“I ended up with was a 5+ year run of exploring identity in virtual worlds, human behaviour (from sex to education to helping to creativity). I was able to develop a working model of the spaces of real life, computer mediated experience, and virtual life.” – Paul J
[2018/09/06 12:26] Gann McGann: “Learning new techniques with regard to live performance, set design, directing and teaching. Teaching both entirely in-world and also in the classroom. A number of performances , some entirely in-world with SLCC and ART , some blended/mixed reality Summer Dancing, SD2, Staging Second Life, and a mixed reality installation in collaboration with Stelarc and Ian Upton.” – Joff
[2018/09/06 12:27] Beth Ghostraven: (Sheila, are you doing the transcript for this or am I?)
[2018/09/06 12:28] Gann McGann: Career and professional development
“Establishment of the Australian and New Zealand Virtual Worlds Working Group (VWWG) (since 2009). Almost all institutions across the two countries involved. Leader in this field of research/teaching.” – Sue G
“Numerous presentations about work in SL done at physical world conferences” – Sheila
“this probably shaped my research interests for much of the (following) 4-5 years. Indeed, quite a bit of my EdD work draws from this experience and exposure.” – Jim
[2018/09/06 12:29] Su Nacht: Not at all. Totally disregarded by institution and colleagues
[2018/09/06 12:29] Camie Rembrandt: Not really, no
[2018/09/06 12:29] Su Nacht: It can feel pretty lonely …
[2018/09/06 12:29] Wisdomseeker (lissena): Organizations are flummoxed by what I do
[2018/09/06 12:29] Sheila Yoshikawa: good word
[2018/09/06 12:29] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): As long as I don’t cost any money, I’m left alone to use SL with online classes. But no real support.
[2018/09/06 12:30] Su Nacht: If it wasn’t for groups like this one or the EuroCALL SIG (for instance)
[2018/09/06 12:30] Marly (marly.milena): Some of us are not connected to institutions but are free lance educators here (having been educators out there)
[2018/09/06 12:30] Wisdomseeker (lissena): even those that have technology subgroups
[2018/09/06 12:30] Marly (marly.milena): Yes
[2018/09/06 12:30] Sheila Yoshikawa: I haven’t tried to interest anyone else in this for years, but thinking I should try again
[2018/09/06 12:30] Su Nacht: Sheila, me too actually 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:31] Su Nacht: So am I!!!
[2018/09/06 12:31] Marly (marly.milena): But I have influenced some institutions to change their ways. LOL
[2018/09/06 12:31] Elli Pinion: Not helped professionally, for same reasons as others state, but has helped my professional “knowledge” by those that I’ve been able to work with here and would not have had that opportunity outside.
[2018/09/06 12:31] Su Nacht: Great thing Marly
[2018/09/06 12:31] Gann McGann: What barriers did you face?
Barriers – specific to Second Life
Technological shortcomings of Second Life
Antipathy towards virtual worlds specifically (Hype coincided with moral panic, It looks like a game)
Barriers related to colleagues (Lack of engagement from colleagues, Lack of desire to experiment, Resistance to change, Protectionism, Risk aversion)
Institutional barriers (ICT problems at institutions, Lack of support for innovation at institution)
[2018/09/06 12:31] Sheila Yoshikawa: and e.g. there did use to be a small but strong UK educators network
[2018/09/06 12:32] Sheila Yoshikawa: perhaps now we could say – Second Life – not as toxic and addictive as Fortnite
[2018/09/06 12:32] Su Nacht: no voice? 😉
[2018/09/06 12:32] Sheila Yoshikawa: Su you mean now?
[2018/09/06 12:33] Su Nacht: no … sorry …
[2018/09/06 12:33] Marly (marly.milena): So frustrating!
[2018/09/06 12:33] Su Nacht: voice fine for me … I was just back on memory lane
[2018/09/06 12:33] Gann McGann: What personal impact did innovating in SL have?
Networking and community
“Networking in SL had a tremendously positive effect on my morale during the five years when I was a solo school librarian. Being able to connect with other librarians helped me stay in touch with the profession when I was very isolated. Attending conferences in virtual worlds makes sharing ideas possible, at a very low expense.” – Beth
“Second Life is a lot about community, I have met a number of people (some of whom I have met in person) with whom I am still friends.” – Joff
[2018/09/06 12:34] Su Nacht: It really resonates with me
[2018/09/06 12:34] AngryBeth Shortbread: Never found a replacement to SL
[2018/09/06 12:34] Su Nacht: Yes!
[2018/09/06 12:34] AngryBeth Shortbread: 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:34] Elli Pinion: Very much so.
[2018/09/06 12:35] Camie Rembrandt: Networking with other educators interested in VWs has been very important
[2018/09/06 12:35] Su Nacht: Yes (but I never tell them what I do, as they don’t care)
[2018/09/06 12:35] Sheila Yoshikawa: @marly yes we can, but it would normally be you are bringing them in for a couple of hours, we do pay external speakers, but we have to bid in advance each year
[2018/09/06 12:36] Su Nacht: It’s usually working on a ‘I’ll buy you a pint’ type of situation
[2018/09/06 12:36] Sheila Yoshikawa: we have a number of library and information practitioners talking about what they do etc.
[2018/09/06 12:37] Su Nacht: 😀
[2018/09/06 12:37] Sheila Yoshikawa: actually those who used to help me in Second Life usually didn’t get paid, they did it because they enjoyed it and knew me
[2018/09/06 12:38] Su Nacht: Same here Sheila, as I wrote, some of them got a pint as a thank you 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:38] Su Nacht: Y
[2018/09/06 12:38] Sheila Yoshikawa: presumably not just a pixel pint ;-))
[2018/09/06 12:38] Su Nacht: 😀 :D:D
[2018/09/06 12:40] Ẏαẕẕ Ącкмann (yazz.skytower): I can’t even access second life from my institutional account on my own computer.
[2018/09/06 12:40] Gann McGann: Research direction and practice
“Immeasurable. I have gone down a R&D path that I would never have foreseen before the advent of VWs. I have changed my view of learning, of teaching and of what is really meant by communities of practice. More than anything, I have been completely seduced by the power of shared experiences in VWs in bringing about expected and emergent learning. In fact, emergent learning is now a real point of interest for me – how it is unpredictable and yet so valuable. A bit of a paradox for traditional views of learning.” – Liz
[2018/09/06 12:40] Gann McGann: Improvement in status and career profile
“HUGE – PhD, research and career opportunities. Almost all my work / research has revolved around SL and I have been able to travel to wonderful places around the globe talking about my experiences. Networking and meeting amazing people both inworld and f2f.” – Sue_G
[2018/09/06 12:41] ThinkererSelby Evans (thinkerer.melville): Web-worlds run in a browser — nothing to install
[2018/09/06 12:41] Marly (marly.milena): Sounds really good, Gann!
[2018/09/06 12:41] Sheila Yoshikawa: like Liz’ quote ” completely seduced by the power of shared experiences in VWs in bringing about expected and emergent learning.”
[2018/09/06 12:41] Su Nacht: Very interesting!!
[2018/09/06 12:41] Gann McGann: Three trajectories recounted by respondents
Work accepted and continuing with it
Work accepted but moved on
Did not have their innovations accepted
[2018/09/06 12:41] Sheila Yoshikawa: so – working in VWs had made them rethink their careers?
[2018/09/06 12:42] Camie Rembrandt: I felt a bit like that, yes – better do other stuff than keep trying to teach using VWs
[2018/09/06 12:43] Su Nacht: 😦
[2018/09/06 12:43] Gann McGann: Why the differences in experience?
Different technologies presenting themselves (serendipitously or otherwise) for exploration.
Different attitudes and support from institutions. Not technical reasons, because although SL does present problems, the fact that virtual worlds were adopted in one institution indicates they could have been adopted in any.
Duckworth and Gross (2014) state the opinion that success is related to “self-control” and “grit”. Not a determinant in these cases (all respondents have similar degrees of grit)
[2018/09/06 12:43] Sheila Yoshikawa: How did you classify me, Gann, “Work accepted and continuing with it”?
[2018/09/06 12:44] Sheila Yoshikawa: me me me
[2018/09/06 12:44] Su Nacht: What do you mean by GRIT? (sorry … non native speaker here .. 😉 )
[2018/09/06 12:44] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Tenacity?
[2018/09/06 12:44] Su Nacht: Thanks!!
[2018/09/06 12:44] Marly (marly.milena): A group of us tried to submit a proposal to a foundation interested in innovations in virtual education. They were so overwhelmed by the number of proposals that ours did not make it, but I am curious about the ones they accepted!
[2018/09/06 12:45] Beth Ghostraven: GRITS (all caps) = Girls Raised In The South
[2018/09/06 12:45] Su Nacht: ?? Beth …???
[2018/09/06 12:45] Su Nacht: Are you trying to confuse me? 😀
[2018/09/06 12:45] Beth Ghostraven: sorry totally irrelevant comment
[2018/09/06 12:45] Su Nacht: 😉
[2018/09/06 12:46] Sheila Yoshikawa: 😉
[2018/09/06 12:46] Beth Ghostraven: :o)
[2018/09/06 12:46] Elli Pinion: lol
[2018/09/06 12:46] Gann McGann: Conclusions
In institutions where innovation by teachers is not integrated there is no support from senior management or colleagues for innovation
In institutions where innovation by teachers is integrated there is almost no support from senior management or colleagues for innovation
The literature overlooks the impact on innovating on the innovators
Innovation exists on that tiny difference
[2018/09/06 12:47] Su Nacht: Sometimes ‘innovation’ is JUST a word that the institution uses to tick some box that they feel are supposed to or are told to tick
[2018/09/06 12:47] Sheila Yoshikawa: sadly tend to agree Su
[2018/09/06 12:47] Su Nacht: And in Ireland
[2018/09/06 12:48] Camie Rembrandt: no voice?
[2018/09/06 12:48] Beth Ghostraven: Gann, did your voice cut out?
[2018/09/06 12:48] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): Comment reflection Gann … About 5 years ago I began to carry out my research in relation to the use of virtual worlds for educational purposes. Since I started my research several researchers told me why I was investigating the VW since they were dying and what was virtual reality from that moment etc … (most people relate VW education to SL or Open Sim). In that process I tried to understand why people had that conception that in my opinion is wrong … I mean that the virtual worlds should not be based on technology and split all strategies from the same … if not rather the essence of what is considered a virtual world (epistemology of it) so that teachers can decide based on their technological and didactic circumstances to choose which virtual world is best for them depending on their social circumstances and context in which they work . That is why I gave myself the task with some colleagues to write my last article …
[2018/09/06 12:48] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): of Categorizing the Educational Affordances of 3 Dimensional Immersive Digital Environments (https://www.informingscience.org/Publications/4056?Type=JournalArticles&JournalID=5) where the idea was to understand the essence of virtual worlds and their relationship with virtual reality and augmented reality to see it from a pedagogical perspective … My question would be if you consider continuing to give importance to technology as a strategic center to carry out an activity didactic in virtual worlds?
[2018/09/06 12:48] Sheila Yoshikawa: are you still speaking?
[2018/09/06 12:48] Sheila Yoshikawa: it’s breaking up
[2018/09/06 12:48] Su Nacht: To be honest with you, I have done with NO help at all and was happier than when I was offered ‘little’ help, that was totally useless and required me to USE the institution’s premises
[2018/09/06 12:49] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): You’re breaking up, Gann.
[2018/09/06 12:49] Sheila Yoshikawa: yes
[2018/09/06 12:49] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): That’s better.
[2018/09/06 12:49] Su Nacht: Thankfully enough VWs provide us with the freedom to work from other places
[2018/09/06 12:49] Beth Ghostraven: yes
[2018/09/06 12:49] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): yes
[2018/09/06 12:49] Camie Rembrandt: yes
[2018/09/06 12:51] Camie Rembrandt: I like that idea of a shared dream 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:51] Sheila Yoshikawa: indeed
[2018/09/06 12:51] Elli Pinion: Exactly!
[2018/09/06 12:51] AngryBeth Shortbread: yep, nice sum up
[2018/09/06 12:51] Camie Rembrandt: Brilliant!
[2018/09/06 12:51] Gann McGann: The literature overlooks the impact on innovating on the innovators
It is a risk.
There is a presumption that institutions drive change and practitioners resist. The reality is the other way round, why does the literature get this so wrong?
There is lack of support for it within institutions – we need to look at why.
[2018/09/06 12:52] Elli Pinion: GREAT point!
[2018/09/06 12:52] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Much more social, sense of place, sense of person for online students than takes place in learning management systems, or talking head conference software. One big obsession I’m seeing at our institution is making sure everything works on a smartphone.
[2018/09/06 12:53] Sheila Yoshikawa: yes ProfDan, even though there is also research showing that students do serious academic work on their laptops, or computers on campus
[2018/09/06 12:53] Marly (marly.milena): We can look at examples from other segments of society. Grass roots movements, the impact of social media, corporate change…many possibilities
[2018/09/06 12:54] Sheila Yoshikawa: there is also the issue of publishers reconfiguring their journal sites for mobile, which drives me mad
[2018/09/06 12:54] Su Nacht: GANN, it would be very interesting to look at an ‘instance of innovation’ in an institution using an activity theoretical framework. I’m sure it would show some interesting contradictions in the system
[2018/09/06 12:55] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): Pedagogical innovation must build its own principles and differentiate itself from technological innovation.
It must also differentiate itself from traditional school practices. The educational uses of 3DIDEs (VW, VR. AR) will arise from the inventive diversity generated in the daily practices of the users of this technology. This pedagogical innovation, with pleasant play and ludic immersion as a learning vehicle, is largely found in the construction of theoretical, conceptual and methodological references and will lead us to a better understanding of the educational possibilities of 3D-IDEs (VW, VR. AR).
[2018/09/06 12:55] Sheila Yoshikawa: “when they start catching up with us” ;-))
[2018/09/06 12:56] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): That was part of our conclusion of our last article.
[2018/09/06 12:57] Sheila Yoshikawa: Wikipedia on activity theory (I know more about this, honest, but pulling on Wikipedia is the easiest) “Activity theory is most often used to describe actions in a socio-technical system through six related elements (Bryant et al. as defined by Leonti’ev 1981 and redefined in Engeström 1987) of a conceptual system expanded by more nuanced theories:
Object-orientedness – the objective of the activity system. Object refers to the objectiveness of the reality; items are considered objective according to natural sciences but also have social and cultural properties.
Subject or internalization – actors engaged in the activities; the traditional notion of mental processes
Community or externalization – social context; all actors involved in the activity system
Tools or tool mediation – the artifacts (or concepts) used by actors in the system. Tools influence actor-structure interactions, they change with accumulating experience. In addition to physical shape, the knowledge also evolves. Tools are influenced by culture, and their use is a way for the accumulation and transmission of social knowledge. Tools influence both the agents and the structure.
Division of labor – social strata, hierarchical structure of activity, the division of activities among actors in the system
Rules – conventions, guidelines and rules regulating activities in the system”
[Gann said that in his PhD research he added to extra elements to these six above – namely]
[2018/09/06 12:58] Gann McGann: presence
[2018/09/06 12:58] Gann McGann: identity
[2018/09/06 12:58] Sheila Yoshikawa: oh yes and you made a 3D model of it in SL I think?
[2018/09/06 12:58] Marly (marly.milena): Triangles, cubes–symbolic models! 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:58] Sheila Yoshikawa: perhaps we can play with that another time
[2018/09/06 12:58] Su Nacht: I remember reading about it Mark … 🙂
[2018/09/06 12:59] Su Nacht: that would be interesting
[2018/09/06 12:59] Sheila Yoshikawa: OK so we are approaching the time to stop
[2018/09/06 12:59] Sheila Yoshikawa: it is nearly 1pm
[2018/09/06 12:59] Su Nacht: That would be fun!
[2018/09/06 13:00] Su Nacht: It would be the focus of the next meeting
[2018/09/06 13:00] Sheila Yoshikawa: no that’s ok I’ll have a go first
[2018/09/06 13:00] Elli Pinion: Would LOVE to talk about that!
[2018/09/06 13:00] Su Nacht: What can be done? Maybe just strengthen the community
[2018/09/06 13:00] Sheila Yoshikawa: 😉 I will contact you about a date
[2018/09/06 13:01] ecoonis – Christian Angel (ecoonis): Thanks for your comments Gann and I was very pleased to meet you.
[2018/09/06 13:01] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Thanks, Sheila and Gann. Excellent discussion!
[2018/09/06 13:01] Su Nacht: create more opportunities for collaboration
[2018/09/06 13:01] Marly (marly.milena): Meantime, people can think abut instances where there has been a shift in an institution and how it happened!
[2018/09/06 13:01] Marly (marly.milena): people
[2018/09/06 13:01] Su Nacht: so true …
[2018/09/06 13:01] ThinkererSelby Evans (thinkerer.melville): My experience in academia predates virtual by about 15 years. But academia was the same then.
[2018/09/06 13:01] Beth Ghostraven: the entire education system needs transforming
[2018/09/06 13:01] Su Nacht: revolution!!!!!
[2018/09/06 13:01] Su Nacht: Take over the institutions 😀
[2018/09/06 13:02] Prof. Dan (profdan.netizen): Time for class. Till next time…
[2018/09/06 13:02] Su Nacht: Bye Dan 🙂
[2018/09/06 13:02] Beth Ghostraven: tc Dan!
[2018/09/06 13:02] Sheila Yoshikawa: No
[2018/09/06 13:02] Sheila Yoshikawa: just to say
[2018/09/06 13:02] Camie Rembrandt: Thank you!
[2018/09/06 13:02] Wisdomseeker (lissena): thank you
[2018/09/06 13:02] Elli Pinion: TY….really excellent information and discussion!
[2018/09/06 13:02] Sheila Yoshikawa: next week I think there’s “Open Forum”
[2018/09/06 13:02] Su Nacht: Thank you for this!
[2018/09/06 13:02] Sheila Yoshikawa: we are here every week
[2018/09/06 13:02] Ẏαẕẕ Ącкмann (yazz.skytower): thank you Gann and all for the comments. It was insightful. I should get back to reading for my thesis.
[2018/09/06 13:02] Marly (marly.milena): A great example of an innovative college is Antioch!~
[2018/09/06 13:02] Su Nacht: Very thought provoking!
[2018/09/06 13:02] Sheila Yoshikawa: the community lives ;-))
[2018/09/06 13:02] Marly (marly.milena): My alma mater
[2018/09/06 13:02] Su Nacht: CIAO
[2018/09/06 13:03] Gann McGann: firstname.lastname@example.org
[2018/09/06 13:03] Beth Ghostraven: I should be back to attending regularly now that the school year is underway
[2018/09/06 13:03] Su Nacht: Buonasera!
[2018/09/06 13:03] Beth Ghostraven: not that anyone was worried, lol
[2018/09/06 13:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: thanks everyone for the lively conversation
[2018/09/06 13:03] Su Nacht: Hope to see you all next week, if I can make it 🙂
[2018/09/06 13:03] Su Nacht: best ..
[2018/09/06 13:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: Thanks very much Mark!
[2018/09/06 13:03] Su Nacht: Bye
[2018/09/06 13:03] Sheila Yoshikawa: Bye
[2018/09/06 13:03] AngryBeth Shortbread: bye